WorshipCentral

3 useful questions: is it biblical? is it legal? is it helpful?

Is it biblical? Difficult to tie down a clear answer on this I would think. I think the Bible would support a position that marrying someone who doesn't share your faith is best avoided, but that doesn't necessarily apply to dating relationships.

Is it legal? Yes. (That was the easy one)

Is it helpful? I think this is where it's clearer. If you argue that it is permissible (biblically) to date someone that doesn't share your faith, is it helpful? Almost always not. But most people think they'll be the exeption.

Could someone be in a band if they're dating an "unbeliever"? If they are a chirstian, and want to serve in worship, I can't see why not. If you excluded everyone based on behaviour that is biblically permissible, but unhelpful, you'll have no-one in the band. I appreciate that it could create a difficult pastoral problem. I'm assuming there no sexual relationship - It's a different matter entirely if there is persistent sexual sin involved.

Potential fallout? Dealing with a painful break up. Accountability on attendence/purity. Issues of whether God or their partner is first priority. To name but a few.

Response to congregational attitude? My honest opinion - none of their business.

What does your minister say?

I would say that there is absolutly nothing biblically wrong with it. So long as it isn't affecting the way that person leads their life. As for any other reason I cannot see how having a relationship with a non christian can get in the way of leading worship any more than having a relationship with a christian would. If we are looking at it from the they might be having sex perspective, then I would say it would be ridiculous to asume that sexual relations are going on unless the person in question has actually told us. This would also be very judgemental. Just because two christians are dating doesn't mean that sexual sin isn't occuring. I think it boils down to ensuring that those on the team are being pastored properly. Ie in small groups mabye accountability, this goes for everyone not just those in relationships.
If the congregation are persieving this as an issue then this seems a litle worrying and some teaching is obviously required to ensure division doesn't occur and gossip doesn't spread. Will x

I agree with Paul, it should be asked as to how helpful it is. Will this person understand your passion for worship? Will this person support it? Or will this person end up dragging you astray. Being a worship leader means being at the front of your church, being involved in leading people into worship and people will ultimately look up to you and your actions. They will imitate their leaders as Timothy is called to imitate Paul in 1 Corinthians. People will imitate leaders as they push people towards God.

Even if it is a band member, would you want other young people to mirror his actions? Because tempation can be so difficult in these situations it may not be the wisest thing. I have had situations in churches I have been in where this has happened and people have fallen into the temptation and it can do real damage sometimes.

Hope this helps

I think these comments all seem useful and sensible, i.e. based on God's thoughts. I am glad to have had some affirmation from you guys who can be more objective and thank God for His guidance to me and the way He seems to somehow manage to consistantly stamp out my more judgemental side with a big foot of overwelming grace!

I will bear these comments in mind if similar situations ever arise again and look back in referance to be encouraged.

Thanks Paul for reminding me of the sensible: biblical/legal/helpful phrase too :)

I am nearly 16 myself, and became rather intrigues upon reading this. I think that adult leaders should not force people not to 'go out' with non-believers, as this could very easily lead to alienating that young person and making them defensive and might also make them resent or not respect the leaders authority.
I have been out with non-christians and christians, and i have to say the whole sex thing is the big issue, i myself have made a conscious decision not to just yet, but i know that many young christians find it incredibly hard. Try teaching on this subject and dnt be too definate - let them make their own decisions. Just support them - we teens need tht.
God Bless
James

to be honest, i don't think there is a definite answer to this.
i mean, i've only ever had one fairly long 'relationship' (considering, and long compared to many of my frinds! was no more than bout 4 months tho!) with a non-christian. and personally i found it really annoying because he was goin round swearin, drinkin, being really stupid and lying to me (which was what ended it). but anyways... i'd rather be with a christian guy - for various reasons, such as the whole sex issue (and not wantin it before marriage, at all, no matter what etc.) and actually wanting to do things for the church and aim my life in God's direction and things like that that a non-christian wouldn't necessarily understand.
As i said, there is no single answer to this, and i think that everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

God Bless
nic
xxx

I think us Christians sometimes come at “grey” areas, like dating non Christians, improperly. We want to be able to apply a “super” theory; so we search for variables and “deal breaking” evidences of if a particular action is acceptable. Even though we acknowledge all things are permissible in Christ, and most people would nod a head at Augustine’s idea: Love God and do what you please, we are uncomfortable with the notion of permissible action under Grace. I think there is a crippling fear of getting it wrong.

So because of that we (being the general collective of “Church”) play it safe, we create formulas to apply to these “gray areas” which eliminate as much risk as possible. But, this doesn’t give any support to those who don’t fit the “safe” mold. I think the only way to tackle these grey areas is to offer your time in a way that allows you to be involved. To allow yourself to risk getting it wrong if you might help someone get it right. Jesus was in the middle of all sorts of “grey areas” in Jewish practice while he dined with tax collectors and associated with prostitutes… there are points at where involvement becomes participation in sinful activity. But I think those areas are clear enough to guide adequately. But, I fear we error just as gravely by condemning the grey without adequate consideration.

For the particular situation in question, I’d advise asking questions to be answered by applying time developing the relationship. “Why does this person prefer to date a non-christian?” “What is the nature of the relationship?” “How does this person view God?” “How does their partner view God?” “Is this an issue of the heart, does it result from a bad experience, is it a simple desire not to be labeled a christian?”… Only then do I think a loving and honest decision could be made.

I’ve struggled with this in my own unique way. As a worship leader who has 0 time to spend with those I lead with. Do I neglect something critically tied to my leadership? I.e., caring for those I lead with and alongside.

I’m not advocating for us to say, “do whatever you want.” Rather, “get involved” as the primary way to understand and tackle the grey areas we Christians face.

Ooooh, Marc Proctor, you sound very wise! I love it!

Favourite quote from you there is:

"risk getting it wrong if it might help someone else get iit right."

Thanks Marc!

sadly i think my problem with all this is that i think its far healthier for someone to stay single than to go out with a non christian. even to not marry. Paul even says in the bible about hard it is for married people (even 2 christians). there is a stigma with single people that theres something wrong with them or that God doesnt love them enough if they dont marry. we need to help people to feel loved enough on their own and not worry about getting married as if they are only half a person until they do. being single you can be hugely useful for God as you are really independant. look at chris tomlin!! he's single and in his 30s.

for me praise God i found a wonderful christian wife, but i could have gone out with some non christians aswell but didnt and stayed single for about 5 yrs. for me it was better to be single than go out with a non christian and i'd still be single now if i hadnt found a christian partner.

not a popular idea im sure but there you go!

as for the issue of a band member dating a non christian its happened to me and almost always the person has left the church as a result of the relationship (although i always let them play in the band and never asked them to stop). now i question the band member as to why they are going out with a non christian and let them think about it, but its ultimately between them and God if they do.

i wonder what Tim or Als stance would be on this?

gav.

I’d agree Gav, I also see an unhealthy pressure on Christian singles to find their “soul mate”. ;) I’d also not advocate dating a non-Christian for anyone serious about their faith. It really makes it hard for both people to enter into a serious relationship if they will not see eye to eye on key issues of faith and values. It wouldn’t be fair to either party!

My thoughts only spoke to how we go about evaluating "grey areas". But, at some point an evaluation or answer must be given even if it is unpopular.

Oh, and Swans... As long as I sound wise thats what counts! right? Its like wearing argyle sweaters to look smart! From here on I'll go by Dr. Proctor! ;)