Wisdom Needed: Moving to 3 services...

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ChrisSayburn From St George's Leeds

28 December 2009 - 3:18pm

Hi all, Would love to hear your thoughts on the following.. In Feb we are moving from two services (10.30am // 6.30pm) to three services (10.30am // 5.00pm // 7.00pm) The evening services will be basically the same with the same talk and speaker. Worship Teams wise, we have two distinct pool of members for both morning and evening, so the morning team is unaffected and will continue to operate as normal the question is regarding the evening team who this affects. Our thoughts so far are either A) the team picked that week do both 5pm and 7pm services (pretty much same set) this would mean we all then have a break in between services and no extra set up hassles. With it being a long day, we would ask for each member just to do one a month (unless they wanted to be put down for two if people were ill // away etc...) We have enough musicians // singers to do this. B) Another suggestion is to have two distinct teams for 5pm and 7pm even though they are the same service, This would need a quick set up of a new team in between services and lots of organisation and quick team distribution over both 5pm and 7pm with it being so close to launch but it could give space for more inclusion of new members and would mean less reliant on 'polished arrangements' as the suggestion was that this would alter the way we did Tuesday practices (the 3rd service decision was only made 2/3 weeks ago btw!) My personal thoughts are it may be too soon to try and do option B with two separate teams as this means a lot of change very quickly, where as with A, it would mean less initial disruption (other than a longer day) and would give members time to settle and help them discern what service they would want to serve at if we did want to transition to option B We are asking the whole ministry for feedback and what they would prefer with them being on the front line as it were, but I thought I would seek some wisdom from people who have been there and done that. How do you operate over duplicate services? What has worked for you? In hindsight what would you do differently etc.. Thanks so much for your time either way.

irish_admiral From Cardiff Vineyard

28 December 2009 - 3:31pm

The guys at my old churches normally had different teams for the 2 services each day. I think you've captured the advantages and disadvantages fairly well of each... a few of my thoughts: - Ideally, it'd be a chance to include some more people in the team. Great. - Same people doing 5pm and 7pm services in a row might get 'worshipped out' ie. it just feels like they're doing a job. - If the same people do the services, would you ask them to stay for the sermon, ministry etc? I don't know how your church is set up. - You could have separate teams for 5pm & 7pm, but ask the later band to share gear with the earlier band as far as possible. This might reduce soundcheck time. - Thought about doing a bit of both? See how each works. Weeks 1 & 3, have separate teams, 2 and 4, the same teams...

Joe "One, two, three, here we go..." www.myspace.com/josephhargreaves

paulrobertson From St Silas, Glasgow

28 December 2009 - 4:43pm

Hey Chris, What kind of turn around time between services are you looking at? As Joe said, is sung worship time beginning and end of services or could the band leave once they'd played in the second service? Would have thought getting a second band setup and sound checked might be a tough ask. Another option would be same band/different worship leader. Would give a different dynamic (even if playing the same songs).

RichClarkson From All Saints, Wellington

31 December 2009 - 10:24am

I would suggest going for 2 different teams if you have the resources for this. We did a similar thing at my old church and although the changeover was pretty stressful at first we got the hang of it and as long as people are expecting it to be a bit messy to start off with it works better in the long run. a couple of reasons to think about: - if new people joining the team are expected to be there from 4-8:30 they may well be less likely to want to get involved. They are likely to want to serve the congregation they are a part of, although they may well be happy to serve the other congregation I'm not sure about having that as an expectation for those involved (this is something I'm struggling with at the moment as we have one service which is mostly resourced by musicians who regularly worship at our other service) - I would be surprised if the 2 services were still identical after a year or 2, they will (or at least should) develop their own distinct congregations and style. having separate bands for each service will help with this and, I imagine, would enable each service to take it's own course a bit easier. I hope these are helpful, both options have advantages but I can see more long term benefits of option B even if it would be harder and messier in the short term. God bless, Rich

http://richclarkson.wordpress.com

ChrisSayburn From St George's Leeds

31 December 2009 - 1:13pm

Thanks guys really helpful as always! Joe, yeah we thought with option B of sharing equipment and the idea of stripping down the ministry at times if needed in the 7pm service, but thank you for sharing that as they are really good things to consider Paul, we would have about 30/40 mins set up (I think). We currently have a slot at the start, offertory song in the middle and a ministry slot (excuse the sloppy language) after the sermon. Rich, yeah the 2 services will develop their own styles in their own right so I agree I think B is probably where we want to be in the long run, my only concern is the team has been through a lot of change already in the past few years and especially in 2009 when we launched the 'worship ministry' with everything coming under one vision and three values, we just need to make sure this isn't the straw that breaks the camels back, especially with it only being 2 months till we launch the 3rd service, which realistically gives us about a month to work it, by the time people settle back in from Jan and we have set a deadline to make a decision. It will be really interesting to see how the teams respond, to see what is sustainable now not just where we want to be, I will keep you informed! All good kingdom fun!

irish_admiral From Cardiff Vineyard

31 December 2009 - 1:51pm

Absolutely... I think they key for you will be a "watch this space" sort of thing, as the guys previously used to doing just a Sunday evening will now have most of that day wiped out if they're playing both. See how people respond, both in the congregation and in the worship team, and don't make any decisions you can't reverse. Perhaps a better idea to say, "we're going to try x, y and z and see how it goes." I think you'll eventually end up at option B, because I know i'd find it tough doing two worship services in a row regularly, and it is a good opportunity to gradually release more people into the worship ministry. Thought about using the youth/student bands perhaps? Or creating one led / anchored by a more experienced worship leader?

Joe "One, two, three, here we go..." www.myspace.com/josephhargreaves

Helen Munt From Streatham Baptist Church

20 February 2010 - 8:19am

Hi Chris, I'd love to know how moving to two services in the evenings went for you guys? We are doing the same with our morning services just after Easter and your fresh experience of the transition would be really valuable. God bless, Helen

gloria aldridge From Stony Stratford Baptist Church

15 March 2010 - 2:48pm

By now Chris I guess you've been up and running for a month or more, I've only just seen this post. We went to 2 morning services last September and are about to enter a reveiw time to reflect what is working, what isn't etc. We too looked at all the options that you have but settled for using the same band, our PA crew in particular thought it would be almost impossible to manage the quick turn a round needed to have 2 different bands, this would also have meant sound checking whilst one congretation is leaving and the other coming in with only 30 mins between the 2. Well, after 6 months, yes we are finding it tiring, we get down to church at 8.15am to set up, sound check, go over any intros, exits that we're not sure of and pray before the 1st service at 9.15. This finishes at 1045 and there is coffee for the congregation leaving and the one coming in to try and preserve the sense of unity in the church, this does seem to work well. In the 2nd service we play for the 1st worship set then whilst the sermon is being preached 'retire' to another room to 'chill' before going back to play for the response time. Most of us play at least twice a month, sometimes alternate weeks, sometimes back to back depending on availability of those on shift work etc. We use the same 'set list' for both services. We do have an evening servce but generally don't play as this is more of a reflective/prayer time for the church. We don't have enough resources to man 3 services. As for the future, watch this space as we reflect and pray. Will be good to hear how you are getting on.

matt osgood From St. Stephen's

16 March 2010 - 1:16pm

Sorry, Chris, I was meant to phone you about this!! Bad me. We went from a 6:30 to a 5 & 7 a couple of years ago with them being basically the same service with the addition of children's groups at the 5. We went for your option A for all the reasons you suggested - less stress between services, group only plays once a month etc. We made arrangements that whoever was sorting out the refreshments for the 5pm service would also buy some sandwiches for the band for between the services - we're generally at church from 3-9pm so it's a long shift (especially when you're the worship pastor and have to do it nearly every week! :) Though ironically we're currently looking at reworking our evening services to make them more distinctive and moving to a 4pm and a 6pm. The 6 would be a big celebration service in the style of what we do at the moment, the 4 would be meant more for those on the fringes of church, especially with young families - so cafe style, not in the main church building, simple worship (probably just a couple of songs led by guitar), more interactivity/discussion etc. Should be interesting to see how it works - we're looking to go ahead with something like that at the beginning of May.

www.RESOUNDworship.org Free New Worship Songs

matt osgood From St. Stephen's

16 March 2010 - 1:16pm

PS Should have said - how's it going with the two evening services?!

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