Michael
From Canterbury Baptist Church
I was reading a book the other day that raised what I thought was an interesting point; this basically being the top 5 things you can admit to in church:
- Feeling tired (in general)
- Sinning (in general)
- Not understanding Revelation
- Occasionally missing your quiet time
- Struggling (in general)
And the top 5 that you can't:
- Lust
- Sinning in any specific way
- Always missing your quiet time
- Planning to murder people
- Getting really bored in church
OK, so the list was somewhat in jest but I do feel it's got a serious point behind it. Have we created a culture / church where it's safe to admit to some sins where everyone gives you the "don't worry, we all struggle, I'll help you through" attitude but others would be greeted with the "woah, we need to stop all your activities in church and pray that God doesn't smite you until you sort this one out"?
Obviously this will differ from church to church, but worryingly I really can see a lot of truth in that list, and there's other potential things I could think that fall into those categories as well!
there are some sins that are so bad that you cant admit them to anyone, you just have to go to that closet private place and repent and confess your sins to god.
better that some people do this that to be ex communicated by the church.
im not talking about all sins.
Hmm, might have misunderstood you Mr Hatch, but i'm not sure that's a great church to be in if they'd excommunicate you for confession!
If you're talking about capital crimes like murder or something, I wouldn't say (a) that a Christian should commit them, but (b) if they did, they should be confessing them to someone and submitting to the laws of the state they're in.
For some peoples' peace of mind in the congregation, you might not have people who were eg. known rapists in the congregation as it might not be condusive to making that community work well as a whole, but there will still be a place for that person in a congregation somewhere if they're truly trying to follow God, even if it's the one that the prison Chaplain leads.
Personally, if i've messed up somewhere, I feel the need to fess up to one of my accountability partners or leaders in church. I always feel better for doing so, and I believe that the general drift of new testament scripture would support that too.
If you can't confess your sins to someone in your church, and keep them secret, doesn't that mean someone could be living a lie? More specifically, in church leadership and discipline terms, if you were to appoint someone as a leader (who you wouldn't have appointed had you known about specific issues in their life), then you'd just have to remove them later if the church then found out. Better to be open about things in the first place maybe?
Michael,
Good post... it's quite funny how often you come across these things. I tend to find that the more people know and trust you, the more specific they will be. I really like home / small / cell groups for this reason... we always make time to pray with people at the end, and it's when most proper ministry is done. I tend to ask people very specific questions, and if they don't feel able to answer in a group, i'll catch up with them one on one at some point to pray it through with them.
i was talking more about the thoughts in my mind, and i wonder how they get there? where do the thoughts come from? when they are not the kind of thoughts i would natually think.
i just keep on rebuking them. this is not the kind of thing i would confess to anybody. its just a repenting thing to me.
i go to small groups to give out not recieve i recieve at home in my devotional time. i come to church to serve and worship nothing else.
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding, but I'd strongly disagree with going to church "to serve and worship nothing else." Yes, it's great to serve and it's great to worship, but we should be receiving as well; we all need support from time to time whether that's through small groups, church or just with a close friend. If nothing else we should be receiving or at least open to receiving from God during worship generally, whether that's at church or not!
I guess the point of my original post was to highlight that there's some sins that are not necessarily worse than any others that just don't seem *acceptable* to talk about in church in general. I've seen lots of examples of people getting up and giving testimonies saying they're tired, struggling in general etc. because that seems like a safe thing to admit. But there's various other things that you just wouldn't hear - I've never heard anyone get up at the front of church and say they find church really dull and they haven't read the bible in months!
Of course there are some things that practically aren't good to admit to in a wide setting, and smaller groups are great for this sort of thing. I just wonder if because of this there's certain things that seem more taboo than others even though they shouldn't be, and thus people find it harder generally to admit to them (and of course may never admit to them for this reason!)
Hi Michael
I think that's the case, and it's usually a slow process of gaining someone's trust so they're willing to confide.
James 1, especially v13-15 talks about the desire (or thought) giving birth to sin. Nipping it in the bud is the right way forward, and given that most sin happens in the head before it happens in practice, i'd be getting people to pray for me if it felt like I was having a spiritual attack in my own head...
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good post michael!
very funny but also with a serious point yes :o)
what kind of way do we admit sins tho? publically? infront of the whole congregation?
or privately to a few close friends?
God bless,
gav.